Cichlids of Victoria

CichlidsofVictoria.com is dedicated to the discussion and husbandry of African Cichlids especially the Victorian species
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:33 am 
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That be cool to see some of his tats

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Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:33 am
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:33 pm 
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I have a local viet. barber who I go to regularley and was getting Viet plakats from his familys friends who owned 2 farms.When he would cut my hair he would tell me to go anytime I want he would have his family take me in so I could visit local fish farms and arenas in the local areas.He was allway's persistant but I never took him up on the offer.

I wish I would have had the chance 1 time to go.He was telling me basicly if I had $15,000 to $25,000 I could go there and buy a fish farm that had natural water springs running threw them.,lol.I kick myself when I think of that.


Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:33 pm
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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:38 pm 
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Ok, sorry for taking a bit to get these on, but I took them the night before we left to Portland. I messed up the story slightly in that he was on a bus in Thailand when he was abducted, they took him into Cambodia on a motorbike like taxi, and at a couple of the borders he tried walking off, but that's when they would catch up with him. Anyways the rest was pretty close. Oh and the tats were done with a long metal rod like needle in Thailand. They monk (not shaman) wanted to give him a much larger one on top, but he already knew he wanted this version of the mountain pillars thing, as he had seen it elsewhere.

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By lazydaze, shot with FinePix E510 at 2009-10-10

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By lazydaze, shot with FinePix E510 at 2009-10-10


Sat Oct 10, 2009 6:38 pm
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 7:37 pm 
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wow crazy. the tiger is sweet.

thats og tattoo..... with an iron needles the size of your arm. i bet it took a while and hurt like amotha....

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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 8:37 pm 
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You are completely right about the needle size, as I saw a video we found of the actual place and we even found the same monk doing a tattoo. I believe he said it only took about 1 hour to his surprise. I guess when you are a Monk, and tattoos are your life you get pretty good. You are also right about the pain. He said the neck one wasn't bad, but the back one hurt like a mofo.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 10, 2009 11:21 pm 
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Wow thanks for posting them, they must of hurt. I got some tats one on both my rist and one on my left side on my ribs, and I almost past out lol and they were done with modern tattoo needles :)

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 11, 2009 3:00 pm 
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Thats cool thanks for shareing.


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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 12:18 pm 
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Could you guys do me a favor and post a topic explain in laymen's terms the whole F# breeder thing? I understand the basics just not very in depth.
I recently bought 2 F1 ruby green males and 3 F2 ruby green females.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 2:01 pm 
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Fern";p="2091 wrote:
Could you guys do me a favor and post a topic explain in laymen's terms the whole F# breeder thing? I understand the basics just not very in depth.
I recently bought 2 F1 ruby green males and 3 F2 ruby green females.


Here ya go:

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/c ... _terms.php

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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 6:58 pm 
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Wild caught Vics....
If the seller was representing that species as F1 or F2 from wild as is implyed... well, some sellers are so dishonest.

Most of the serious guppy guys I know use the Gn nomanclature; G1, G2, G3.... as they are trying to keep track of breeding lines. The F numbers are more of a hobbiest thing when selling fish. The assumption that F1 or F2 means "generations from wild" is misguided. You really have to ask. Mendalian genetics says I can create G1/F1 fish anytime I breed two unrelated lines (not brother and sister).

IMO, because cichlids are such a genetically plastic species, that in two or three generations the color of a fish can dramatically change that any thing beyond F2 is meaningless. F3 fish are basically "tank raised" or "line bred".

Pantara,
Here is a link to US Fish and Wildlife:
Importing and Exporting Your Commercial Wildlife Shipment
http://www.fws.gov/le/impexp/CommWildli ... Export.htm
I believe it is true that only scientific researchers can take fish from Victoria.


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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:11 pm 
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Lol, becareful Teknik, allot of us breed WC fronts on this forum, and sell REAL F1 fry. You are right that outside of the hobby F1 or G1 can be any two unrelated fish being bred basically, but us front breeders take F1 pretty seriously 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Wild caught Vic's
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:36 pm 
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Me";p="3816 wrote:
Lol, becareful Teknik, allot of us breed WC fronts on this forum, and sell REAL F1 fry. You are right that outside of the hobby F1 or G1 can be any two unrelated fish being bred basically, but us front breeders take F1 pretty seriously 8)
I my self have a colony of F1 from wild Frontosa gibberosa Kitumba.
See, that's not hard, just add "from wild" and everything is clear with no shenanigans or misunderstandings.

I also have F1 hybrid mated pair of Julidochromis dickfeldi x Lamprologus leleupi. :P Front food factories.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 11:50 am 
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To follow up on the scientific avenue of import/export, I have this from the Cornell University Museum of Vertebrates:
"International permit requirements for scientific collecting vary from country to country. To find out about permit regulations for individual countries, contact the State Dept. in Washington, D.C., to get the U.S. embassy contact information (phone number or e-mail) for that country. Each country has a separate State Dept. phone number, which can be obtained from the following URL: http://www.state.gov/p/af/ci/index.htm . Additional permit information may be posted on the web site of the Natural Science Collections Alliance. This includes proposed new federal permits listed in the Federal Register."
Pretty much, if one was to get a live speciman from a scientific collection it would have to be spawn, I believe.

"USFWS permits also are required for collection of other regulated wildlife, i.e., endangered/threatened species (Endangered Species Act), marine mammals, CITES-listed species, and "injurious wildlife.""

Here is a database regarding CITIES-
"CITES (the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora) is an international agreement between governments. Its aim is to ensure that international trade in specimens of wild animals and plants does not threaten their survival."
http://www.cites.org/
Luckily, only one PERCIFORMES is on the list: Labridae Wrasses. So no international trade agreement affects Haplochromis trade.

Will look more....


Fixed broken links

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Last edited by teknikAL on Tue Feb 09, 2010 8:03 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:24 pm 
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Quote:
Here is a database regarding CITIES-
"CITES (the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora) is an international agreement between governments. Its aim is to ensure that international trade in specimens of wild animals and plants does not threaten their survival."
http://www.cites.org/


I don't know if Australia is a member of CITES but I am going to find out

Then I am going to go to my local Member of Parliament and point out how the NON international trade in some species may threaten their survival. :D

Yeah, I'm an optimist


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:34 am 
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Oz has some pretty invasive non native species:rat, rabbit, & a huge poison carnivorous toad.

You may have better luck getting close to the scientific community.
Here is the idea. If active collections are being made, contact one of the collectors; researcher, their assistant. If they are sending dried or alchohol specimans, they may be persuaded to send some live.... at least that's the idea.

There is a local fellow with Cornell who has been to Tanzania last year collecting in the rivers looking for synodontis catfish and building "All Catfish Species Inventory (ACSI) http://www.siluriformes.org/
I checked the Fishnet2 http://www.fishnet2.net/index.html and saw Cornell on the list of partners. I submitted a query "Genus = Haplochromis" on the Cornell Database and came back with ten collections of Haplochromis most recently in 2007; 5 bloyeti 5 not described. From there I got a link to a maped with the locations of collection with GPS.
(link changed)
The idea is to contact him to see if he does send back live collections and when his next expedition is. Here is the issue with Wild Victorian Basin Cichlids. From the data above you can see that the likelyhood of getting an undescribed, unnamed species is very high. 50% of the sampling were unnamed. I don't know if anyone wants unnamed Victorians in the hobby.

I looked for The Austrailian Museum http://australianmuseum.net.au/
and found they are a partner. I query on the same boolean and get this:
(link changed)
Two specimens held in their collection. Not really sure what they are, there is not much info. It doesn't seem as Oz has much scientific interest in cichlids, well Haplochromis at least.
Looks like you may have to leave the country to own better cichlids, mate...

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Last edited by teknikAL on Thu Feb 25, 2010 9:26 am, edited 3 times in total.

Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:34 am
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