Cichlids of Victoria

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 Post subject: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 2:46 pm 
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Before I get started, just know I think I speak for everyone when I say we are very very very very very happy with the order from Europe, and can't thank our european counterparts enough!

This question regards one mystery fish which came in with my Neochromis rufocaudalis Saa Nane group, and two mystery fish KevinB received with his Mbipia lutea "Makobe Island". I am posting this thread with permission from KevinB to be clear.

The fish in my group of rufocaudalis Saa Nane looks to me like a Mbipia lutea "Makobe Island", and the two fish in his group of Mbipia lutea "Makobe Island" look like possible rufocaudalis Saa Nane candidates. Some believe his may be morphs, and this may be true, but we both want to be certain.

Here are some videos of the mystery fish in my tank, and below is a link to KevinB's fish.

[youtube]pMVQaIUMcjo[/youtube]
[youtube]eP9cebh4b2U[/youtube]
[youtube]UOx70GRXEM0[/youtube]


http://www.cichlidsofvictoria.com/viewt ... highlight=


Sun Oct 03, 2010 2:46 pm
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 4:51 pm 
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and here are some pics of the fish in my tank, sorry not the best quality. The last one with it hiding in the heater mount shows his true colors pretty well. The speckling in the tail and predorsal as well as the little line of red running the top of dorsal (not too visible in the pics) is what really got me wondering.



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By lazydaze at 2010-10-03
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By lazydaze at 2010-10-03
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By lazydaze at 2010-10-03


Sun Oct 03, 2010 4:51 pm
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:58 pm 
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Hi,

you are right. The videos show a Mbipia lutea male in its typicalk behavior: chasing, chasing, chasing.
The pics of Kevin seem to show younger Neochromis rufocaudalis.


Sun Oct 03, 2010 10:58 pm
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:16 am 
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Thanks Axel, beautiful fish. his shape is so similar to the Saa nane but he does seem to chase the other fish around even more than the dominant saa nane Male. Which is amazing! :lol:


Mon Oct 04, 2010 12:16 am
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:33 am 
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Yea, that clip looks almost exactly like my male Mbipia lutea.

I've had a few losses in that tank. But this means I have 1M:3F (3.5 cm) Mbipia lutea and three (3 cm) unsexed Neochromis (rufocauldalis I assume?)

And since the M. lutea have successfully bred (and I witnessed and filmed the breeding so I know it's not a cross) I'm feeling kinda lucky. I've had the rufocauldalis before and they are one of my favorites. I love all vics with blue plus red.

I obtained the rufocauldalis as adults previously. The adult female rufocauldalis were plain silver so I assume I have three male N. r.?

Kevin
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Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:33 am
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:45 am 
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Lol, don't you know by now I never sleep ;)

In all seriousness my wife is in Japan and I am unemployed and we chat most every night/morning about this time, so this is pretty normal for me. I was about to ask you the same thing, but then remembered you are a couple hours ahead of me.


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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:58 am 
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The female Saa Nane's are supposed to have an olive tone (not sure if this lasts through adulthood). It seems to come and go a bit, but now I'm scouring this tank with my eyes looking for any other misfits. How many Makobe's were supposed to be in your order Kevin? I had one spawn which are now free swimming fry, I know from checking my video's and pics she was a Rufocaudilis, but I honestly didn't witness the spawn. They are tiny, but do all seem to have an olive tone, so that's encouraging. I guess I will have to grow them to at least an inch and half before I can be sure there was no mixing.

Just to clarify, there was absolutely no mixing in any of my other species from europe. The three other species are all much more easily identifiable, as they have very unique physical characteristics. My only guess is at some point mine and Kevins fish were next to each other, and played puddle hop. At least we know now, and have the best eyes around the world to help us sort this out. Kevin I would post all three fish individually in this thread, and if there are any other that are unclear do the same. I will be separating the Makobe tonight and from there watching for anyone else to change color and will post any questionable fish in this thread. Let's call it a learning experience for the forum.

Axel thanks again for your help, it's great to have you and your colleagues aboard.


Mon Oct 04, 2010 3:58 am
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:14 am 
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Hi,

our N. rufocaudalis females all have an olive tone.
But in 1995 I got from Ole Seehausen Neochromis rufocaudalis from Python Island, Makobe Island and Saa Nane Island.
As far as I remember were the females from Python Island more silvery.
The problem is that the only rufo. species which is found in whole Europe today is called N.rufo. Saa Nane Isl. But I am not really sure if there was not someone who mixed the three types together. When I look at the head shape of some males I find that some are more round and some are a little longer than others. The N.r. Python Island had a more round head shape.
Never the less, the "today" Saa Nane Island is the only rufo. species which we have in Europe. I tried to select a small group with round heads to start a new tribe, but there were to few to have success.


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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:53 am 
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Theses are pics from the colony I had:

Image
Image

Kevin


Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:53 am
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 4:57 am 
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I'm glad we got this all straiten out now.

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http://www.jnjcichlids.com/
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"When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes DUTY!"
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:05 am 
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Hello @ all,

the only facility is, that I was confused :? and confound the two bags from Thomas… or Thomas wrote the false speciesname on the bags :D
But it´s easy to distinguish these two species…

Sorry my mistake… :?

Greetings Marco


Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:05 am
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:16 am 
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marcowelss";p="7668 wrote:
Hello @ all,

the only facility is, that I was confused :? and confound the two bags from Thomas… or Thomas wrote the false speciesname on the bags :D
But it´s easy to distinguish these two species…

Sorry my mistake… :?

Greetings Marco



It's understandable Marco, you had allot on your plate. Truthfully I am not at all sad about having this fish, as Axel mentioned it is gorgeous. I put him in with the Matumbi hunters and a few Rusty's to keep the attention away from only him. he is doing fine, but has colored down some since the matubi's have a good inch or more on him. After I removed him I found a Rufocaudilis female holding the next morning. This time I know for sure what she's holding 8)


Last edited by Me on Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:20 am, edited 2 times in total.

Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:16 am
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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:19 am 
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KevinB";p="7660 wrote:
Theses are pics from the colony I had:

Image
Image

Kevin



Maybe I am wrong but to me that male looks like a Neochromis Rufocaudilis Makobe. I think I came across it on the german site when I was creating the "euro list with pics" thread. Also the females do look silver compared to mine. Gorgeous male Kevin !!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 3:30 am 
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marcowelss";p="7668 wrote:
Sorry my mistake.
Marco


No problem. We all understand that stuff happens.

This importation one of the most exciting things to happen in our US fish hobby and we have Marco, Thomas and Axel to thank. (OH. And Allen and Jim too)

Kevin

ME,

My "dark" Neochromis is turning very blue.


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 Post subject: Re: ID help needed Calling all Germans! : )
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 9:49 pm 
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Yeah, they are beautful. truthfully I wanted the Rufocaudilis Makobe when the order was first being put together, but Axel or Marco told me it was not an easy fish to get. That's why I remember the look, and suspect that you had Makobe in the past. The Saa Nane's I have seen pics of seem to lack the mottled look, and have a darker blue. Maybe the Axel or Marco can shed some light on this.

I always feel like I snuck into the vic party late in the game while no one was looking, and so feel the need to repeat how inexperienced I am. I am trying my best to be useful though so I can stay till the after party when things get really good ;)


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